ON RESUMPTION
MR VAN DER HEYDE: ...as well as Mr Myaka and a Mr Mhlongo. Now I first want to refer the Honourable Committee to Mr Mugwene's application. He has now indicated, after I consulted again with him, that there are no offences on which he would apply for amnesty and that he's in fact withdrawing his amnesty application.
CHAIRPERSON: Is Mr Mugwene present?
MR VAN DER HEYDE: He is present.
CHAIRPERSON: With you there, or at the back?
MR VAN DER HEYDE: He's at the back.
CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mugwene, could you come forward please? Mr Mugwene, I understand from your legal representative that you're withdrawing your application, is that correct?
MR MUGWENE: Yes, Sir.
CHAIRPERSON: And according to what he told us, the reason therefore is that you feel and he might have felt the same, that you committed no offence, is that correct.
MR MUGWENE: Yes.
CHAIRPERSON: Your version was in fact that you infiltrated the police in order to get information which you could use for your organisation?
MR MUGWENE: Yes.
CHAIRPERSON: Now you're not applying for amnesty for any assaults or murders or whatever it might have been? I'm sorry, they couldn't hear your answers, but up to the present stage you agree with all the statements I've made, is that correct?
MR MUGWENE: Yes, Sir.
CHAIRPERSON: Is there anything you want to say or to add? If so, you should perhaps put on the earphones and if you want to speak in English you could do so. If there's anything you want to tell us or want to say to the public, you may do so, it's an opportunity now, but we're noting that you've withdrawn your application.
MR MUGWENE: Yes, Sir.
CHAIRPERSON: Thank you. Is that all you want to say?
MR MUGWENE: Yes, Sir.
CHAIRPERSON: In your statement you said that you knew that if you would point out members of the ANC or the liberation movement, that those members could have been arrested and tortured and killed, is that correct?
MR MUGWENE: There was that possibility.
CHAIRPERSON: Now if you knew that, why did you - sorry.
ADV SIGODI: ...(indistinct - mike not on)
INTERPRETER: The mike please.
CHAIRPERSON: In once instance on page 23, you were talking about a man Msoani and you state that you in fact stabbed him with a bottle.
MR MUGWENE: I can't follow. May you repeat yourself.
CHAIRPERSON: Sorry?
MR MUGWENE: Repeat yourself again.
CHAIRPERSON: You walked after Nkosani, is that correct?
MR MUGWENE: Yes, Sir.
CHAIRPERSON: You picked up a bottle, smashed it on the ground and stabbed him with the remainder of the bottle.
MR MUGWENE: ; Yes, Sir.
CHAIRPERSON: Now isn't that an assault?
MR MUGWENE: According to the instructions which I was given.
CHAIRPERSON: I think perhaps Mr van der Heyde this matter should stand down and you should reconsider because I want Mr Mugwene at least to be fully aware of the implications of withdrawing his application and I'll reverse the statement that we note that the application has already been withdrawn and to have a look at page 23 at least and see whether in the light thereof, you still think that you should withdraw your application.
MR VAN DER HEYDE: Thank you.
