MR BOOYENS: Booyens on record, Mr Chairperson, I call Mr Tait. His application can be found on page 82.
MR SIBANYONI: Your full names, Mr Tait.
JOHAN HENDRIK TAIT: (sworn states)
MR SIBANYONI: Thank you, you may be seated. Sworn in.
EXAMINATION BY MR BOOYENS: It is an Afrikaans Tait, Mr Chairperson, but he understands what you have said.
Mr Tait, you have your amnesty application before you, is that correct? And you provide the background, your personal background on pages 81, 82 and 83, is that correct?
MR TAIT: Yes, that is correct.
MR BOOYENS: Now on page 84 you give your recollection of this incident in Swaziland, is that correct?
MR TAIT: Correct, Chairperson.
MR BOOYENS: At the stage when you went to see my attorney of instruction, Mr van der Merwe, did you have any point of reference with regard to what any of the other applicants stated about this incident in Swaziland, or anything of that nature, or did you have to rely purely on your own recollection?
MR TAIT: I had to rely purely upon my own recollection,
Chairperson.
MR BOOYENS: Very well. Now where you give a description of the incident, on page 84, there are just a few aspects that I would like to deal with. In the first place you were not certain of the date, you said that it was during 1988, is that correct?
MR TAIT: Yes.
MR BOOYENS: And we have heard that it was February 1989.
MR TAIT: That is correct, Chairperson.
MR BOOYENS: You have also mentioned four activists, who according to your knowledge were killed, who were in transit to receive military training abroad and you have stated that there were four. This is on page 84.
MR TAIT: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: And you have heard Mr de Kock state that only three persons were killed. Was it your recollection at the stage when you made your statement that you thought that there were four persons inside the vehicle?
MR TAIT: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: You heard Mr de Kock say that you did not make use of any lights, so it was very dark.
MR TAIT: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: Therefore, this figure of four that you may have heard somewhere or surmised or thought, is this the figure that emerged in }our mind when you made your affidavit?
MR TAIT: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: And your description of the incident is that Capt Moss actually drove the vehicle into the ambush and jumped out and ran away. That is the description that you gave to Mr van der Merwe at that stage.
MR TAIT: Correct.
MR BOOYENS: Now you have heard Mr de Kock say that he thinks that you may be confused with another incident which took place near Piet Retief during which this scene actually took place. Is it possible that you may confused?
MR TAIT: Yes, it is highly possible that I may be confused.
MR BOOYENS: Now let us deal with the preceding events, before you departed from the Republic. Did Mr de Kock tell you what you were going to do?
MR TAIT: That is correct, Chairperson.
MR BOOYENS: And you heard his explanation that it was basically conveyed to you that these were persons who were involved in terrorist activities in the RSA, who were going to continue their activities in Swaziland.
MR TAIT: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: At that stage did you have any reason to doubt Mr de Kock's information?
MR TAIT: No.
MR BOOYENS: Did you accept it as correct?
MR TAIT: Yes.
MR BOOYENS: And did you accept that this was the sort of work which was in either event was carried out by Vlakplaas?
MR TAIT: Yes.
MR BOOYENS: Your primary function was to combat terrorism.
MR TAIT: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: So Mr Tait, with regard to you, to shoot these terrorists dead and to plan such a shooting was part of the war that you were involved in?
MR TAIT: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: I see that you have also mentioned on page 84 that you recall that Willie Nortje was present and you have already heard that his legal representative has stated that he was not present during the operation. Is it possible that you may have confused his presence in this operation with his presence in another?
MR TAIT: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: Mr Tait, you were discharged from the Police Force, due to post-traumatic stress disorder.
MR TAIT: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: And part of having post-traumatic stress disorder is memory problems.
MR TAIT: Yes.
MR BOOYENS: You have heard Mr de Kock's description of what took place after you crossed the border into Swaziland.
MR TAIT: Correct.
MR BOOYENS: Does this correlate more-or-less with your personal recollection of what took place on the Swaziland side of the border?
MR TAIT: Correct.
MR BOOYENS: You were a member of the group of persons who were physically involved in the shooting on the Swaziland side of the border.
MR TAIT: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: And I don't believe that it is necessary to dwell extensively on this because Mr de Kock has already stated it. According to you, your recollection of what took place in Swaziland is more-or-less the same as that of Mr de Kock.
MR TAIT: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: You also crossed the South African border with a false passport?
MR TAIT: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: You were aware that there would be weapons which would be smuggled over illegally from the country into Swaziland and then illegally returned to the country from Swaziland. These would be your weapons that you were going to use.
MR TAIT: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: And you received an instruction, but you were also part of the planning to eliminate these persons in Swaziland.
MR TAIT: Correct.
MR BOOYENS: And you request amnesty for conspiracy to murder, for transgressions of the Weapons and Ammunitions Act, for the illegal possession and illegal import and export of weapons, as well as the crossing of a South African border with counterfeit documents, as well as for any delictual accountability that you may be held responsible for emanating from this case?
MR TAIT: That is correct.
CHAIRPERSON: Can I interrupt at this stage and ask you gentlemen if you could combine with one another to give us detailed list of the various offences for which you're asking for amnesty and the Sections of the Act and what have you.
MR BOOYENS: Certainly, Chairperson, I will ask my colleagues who have got access to a library, whether they could oblige us in this regard, people like Mr Hattingh or Mr Visser or somebody like that.
CHAIRPERSON: It doesn't have to be done immediately.
MR BOOYENS: Yes, on. Thank you, Chairperson.
Possibly just one further aspect, Mr Tait. At the shooting, did you approach the vehicle after the shooting and observe the persons inside the vehicle physically?
MR TAIT: No.
MR BOOYENS: Thank you, Chairperson, nothing further.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR BOOYENS
FURTHER EXAMINATION BY MR BOOYENS: Possibly just one further aspect, Mr Chairperson.
Do you also confirm, subject to the amendments that you have indicated, do you confirm the rest of your amnesty application?
MR TAIT: Yes.
MR BOOYENS: Thank you.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR BOOYENS
MR HATTINGH: Hattingh on record, Mr Chairman, I have no questions, thank you.
NO QUESTIONS BY MR HATTINGH
MR CORNELIUS: Cornelius on record, Mr Chairman, I have no questions.
NO QUESTIONS BY MR CORNELIUS
MR NEL: Mr Chairman, Nel, I have no questions.
NO QUESTIONS BY MR NEL
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR ROSSOUW: Rossouw on record, Mr Chairman.
Mr Tait, I do not wish to ask you a question, I just want to put a statement to you. Thank you for your concession with regard to Mr Nortje. I just want to put it for the sake of completion that Mr Nortje denies any involvement in this operation.
Thank you, Mr Chairman.
NOTHING FURTHER BY MR ROSSOUW
MR BOTHA: Botha, Mr Chairman, I've got no questions.
NO QUESTIONS BY MR BOTHA
MR VISSER: Visser, Mr Chairman, I have no questions, thank you.
NO QUESTIONS BY MR VISSER
MR VAN HEERDEN: Van Heerden, Mr Chairman, no questions.
NO QUESTIONS BY MR VAN HEERDEN
ADV STEENKAMP: No questions, thank you, Mr Chairman.
NO QUESTIONS BY ADV STEENKAMP
MR SIBANYONI: I've got no questions, Mr Chairman.
ADV SANDI: I've got no questions.
MR BOOYENS: Thank you, Chairperson. May Mr Tait be excused.
CHAIRPERSON: On the usual conditions.
WITNESS EXCUSED
