COMMISSIONER: Good morning and welcome.
MR MOFOKENG: Thank you, sir.
LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: (s.s.)
COMMISSIONER: Mr Mofokeng, my colleague Miss Hlangewe Mkese is going to be helping you in telling your story and I hand over to her. Thank you very much.
MISS MKESE: I greet you Mr Mofokeng.
MR MOFOKENG: I also greet you.
MS MKESE: I will request you to briefly tell me what is happening here because you are Lefoka Mofokeng and then you are here on behalf of Lucas Mandla Lovo.
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: Yes, that is correct.
MS MKESE: I will request you to tell us briefly about your son Lucas. What kind of person he was, as you have watched him growing.
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: My son was just an ordinary boy. He was just silly like any other teenager but there was nothing different about him. It is just that in many ways I was a father I was not staying with him most of the time and I would like to believe that he was not a silly boy, he was just like any other kid. I think it was in September, it was 1976 he had gone with his friends, they were from Sharpeville in Vereeniging. They went to Johannesburg. When they got to Johannesburg he went to see his other friends. He even - of black power. When he showed that HRV/817 sign/...
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sign or he made that sign that is when the police shot him. Shot him at the back. His friends ran away. He was taken to the Baragwanath Hospital. When he was taken to the Baragwanath he was assaulted and also kicked, especially his face was swollen. When the other children went to see him a friend of my daughter's came to tell us about Lucas' injuries and he helped us trace him. We went there but when they went there they were chased away, up to such time that he was referred to the General Hospital. Even at General Hospital it was very difficult for us to see him. My children kept on being chased away. He was put in the ICU ward. When he was at the ICU on another day when they went to see him they were told that Lucas was not there, he had run away. He had skipped the country. But they never wanted to tell us as to how he was when he left. They just could not explain as to how he sustained his injuries and how he was when he left. Now they took his two photos, these appeared in the worlds newspaper that he should be traced. When this appeared in the newspapers the police chased my daughter. There was a rumour that he had skipped the country and he was in exile. Now all this was taken as if it was a rumour from his friends but the very same friends who were with him on that particular day had all gone out, had skipped the country. There was also a rumour that he was able to skip the country together with them. That is when we had a hope that possibly when he went out he was able to skip the country and run away. But even though it was like that I personally never knew anything as to how he skipped the country because I believed that all the organisations, especially the students uprising, most of the children used to come to me and we also wanted to know as to HRV/817 who/...
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who was coming and who was arriving at that particular time. But I never heard anything about my son. Nobody told me about my son. Up till such time that when I got here I received the news that as I have already said, I had a hope that when other children were coming back, that is his friends, he was also going to be amongst them. But he was never to be seen. I tried by all means to take further steps in order to try and trace his whereabouts. Many of them as well as friends of the family, there were rumours circulating that he had been seen on television amongst the people who were actually arriving. Some had heard that other friends of his had come back. It is true that some came back but we never actually met them. I took further steps, I went to the United Nations Embassy to try and look at their roll, their list of names, maybe I could see his name amongst the names that were listed there. I had a hope that I would see his name as he was an exile. But I could not see his name. I could not get any person that I could talk to about my son. Up till today. I decided to give up the search for my son because I kept on asking myself as to where he had gone to because others had come back but he didn't come back. I kept on wondering as to where he was. I thought maybe he was using a different name when he was outside the country. And probably that is why I could not trace him. As it was still like that trying to trace the whereabouts of my son and trying to get the names that they used when they were outside the country, probably if I could know this name I could be able to trace him. Maybe that is how I lost. I believe that during all that time even if he was left behind at the time he was supposed to have been here by now. Even some of his friends have now already HRV/817 died/...
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died. There is a lady that he was supposed to get married to but the lady has since been deceased. But the police at the end told us that he had run away. When they went to look for him he ran away and they couldn't get him anyway. That is where his history ends. Up till now that I have come to report nobody knows where he went to. We last heard that he was at the hospital when he was shot by the police and we were told that he had skipped the country. But I can't get him. That is all I can say.
MS MKESE: I will help you to try and relate this matter further. I will take you a little bit back. You told us that Lucas went out in September 1976. Maybe you can tell us whether he was affiliated to any political group or he was just a student.
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: He was a student at that time. We heard rumour that as he was greeting his friends he made this sign of black power. Then it is possible that he was a member or affiliated to a political group but I cannot say which political group that he belonged to.All I know is that he was shot because he made the sign of black power. That is when his friends ran away. That is how he got injured. MS MKESE: If you can still remember can you tell us how old he was at that time.
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: I don't remember quite well, I am not very clear but he was plus minus 20 years old.
MS MKESE: You have told us that he was shot. According to your knowledge was he armed, did he know how to use a gun?
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: No, I don't believe so. He didn't know how to use a gun and he didn't have a gun at that time because nothing about the gun appeared. Because
HRV/817 he was/...
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he was only shot for making the sign, the black power sign. MS MKESE: I will take you even a little bit further back. I want you to tell this Commission about the time when he was admitted at the hospital I want to know whether you spoke to the hospital authorities, whether the police who told you that he had run away - it was the police who told you he had run away.
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: When my daughter had gone with other children, that is the one who comes after Lucas, she was told that he had been taken to the police station. When they got to the police station they were told that he was amongst the group that had skipped the country. But there was absolutely no peace.
MS MKESE: When you say it was the police who told you that he had skipped the country, do you know the policemens' names or do you just know that it is the police? Which department were they working for.
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: No, it is very difficult for me to say. I know that they were policemen. I don't know what their names were. I don't even believe that I can identify them even today because he was with the police. I never saw the police with my own eyes.
MS MKESE: You went on to say you think that he probably skipped the country. Did you ever go to the SACP people or the ANC people to try and find out as to whether he really did skip the country or he just ended up in South Africa?
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: I went to all the places, those organisations but I couldn't get a relevant person who could explain to me as to what had exactly happened after he had been shot and how he skipped the country. It was just rumour. But there was no substantiation of the fact that he
HRV/817 had/...
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had actually skipped the country after being shot. All I know is that he was shot at the back and he was under heavy police guard. As to how and when he skipped the country was quite puzzling and I realised that I had to take further steps.
MS MKESE: Thank you very much.
DR RANDERA: Mr Mofokeng, I also just want to clarify again please. Can you tell us, I know you say you weren't quite sure whether it was in 1976 or 1977 that Mandla had been shot. When was the last time you saw him?
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: I last saw my son during those times I was already out in exile but I received the information when I was still outside. Then I came here to try and find out as to what had exactly happened and what had happened to my children whom I left at that time. That is when I started knowing as to what life or sort of life that he lived. When I came back. I only knew then that when I went away he also followed me and that was all that I was told about his skipping the country. That is quite a number of years since I had seen him.
DR RANDERA: You were in exile yourself and when did you come back? When did you come back?
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: I believe I came back in 1988. DR RANDERA: Can I then just ask in terms of your wife and I think you mentioned your daughter, did they go and visit him either at Baragwanath Hospital or at the General Hospital as you mentioned?
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: They tried several times and they were being chased so rudely.
DR RANDERA: So none of the family members saw him after he was shot?
HRV/817 MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG/...
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MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: There is absolutely no one who saw him except that as my daughter was known there they got information thereafter. They were told by the nurses at the hospital as to how his condition was but they could not see him because they kept on being chased away. Even when they were at the hospital they were always told they could not see him. They were chased from inside. Even the police chased them.
DR RANDERA: You say that some friends saw him and that his face was very swollen after he was shot because he had been kicked and hit. Can you give us the names of those friends?
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: Yes I do know those friends. I think the two of them have come back. We traced and got them. We couldn't get his friends anywhere, we couldn't trace them. The two have come back but we never actually got hold of them. At the time when he was shot they were together with his friends.
DR RANDERA: Is it possible then because you say that it is a rumour that Mandla left and the police told somebody that Mandla had escaped, is it possible then that he could have passed away in hospital and not left the country at all?
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: That is quite possible because there could be two sides to this coin. It is either he skipped the country or he died at the hospital under police guard. These are the two coins, whichever one can be possible.
DR RANDERA: My last question is you say you were in exile. Which political movement were you with when you were in exile?
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: I was a member of the ANC.
DR RANDERA: Thank you very much.
HRV/817 PROFESSOR MEIRING/....
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PROFESSOR MEIRING: Father, I would like to ask one question. You are not the only person testifying about the sadness of the loss of a child who disappeared in exile without coming back. What advice could you give to the Truth and Reconciliation Commission, what can we do to you and to other people in the same boat as you are in?
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: I believe that this is very important because whatever the Commission can do for us, especially that we have lost our loved ones. According to my own feelings I don't believe that I will ever see him again. I don't believe that he is still alive. According to the statements that we got from people I don't believe that it is easy for me to be able to see him again. I wanted this Commission to help me, if it is possible, for us to know whether he is still alive or what is happening but he has left an orphan. He had a child with a certain lady who has since been deceased. He was supposed to have married this woman. Now the woman has died and there is a child who is now an orphan left behind. I would like the Commission to help in any way that it can with regard to this child.
PROFESSOR MEIRING: Thank you very much.
MS JOY SEROKE: Mr Mofokeng, you say you suspect that your son did not leave the country, he died in hospital. And in your statement you said some people said they saw him on the television. What was he doing when they saw him? Was it just the name that appeared or his photo?
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: It is possible that whoever saw him thought he was seeing him and he was probably not seeing him. Maybe it was somebody who looked like him. Because when they came they were a group and two people came and told me that they had seen him, he was in a group of
HRV/817 people/...
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people arriving from exile but he never actually appeared. He never came home.
MS JOY SEROKE: You even said, Mr Mofokeng, when he was shot his friend was also shot but he managed to run. Where is the other one with whom he was when he got shot?
MR LEFOKA LAWRENCE MOFOKENG: I think there is a mistake. Either I made the mistake. When he was shot the one he was with was not shot. He is the one who got shot. The other one managed to run away. They were the ones who explained to me as to what had actually happened. They came to my place.
MS JOY SEROKE: Thank you very much, Mr Mofokeng.
COMMISSIONER: We thank you very much. Many times we feel weak. We run short of words that we can use to try and pass condolences because you have lost your loved one and the most unsettling thing about this is that you were told lies continually because you kept on harbouring the hope that he could possibly be alive. But as many things have happened as well as the rumours it is possible that he died in hospital. But the police never informed you or never told you the truth. Just to add on to the pain, you were put in a state of uncertainty. We do not know what we can do but we shall try to help you and your family to try and see as to how we can solve this problem, break this secrecy. We do hear that you wish that the Commission could help you with regard to your grandchild. We thank you very much.
