MS GOBODO
We have now come to the end of the Paarl Hearings. It is with a very deep sense of sadness to be leaving this town. We came very much a part of it. But I would just like to briefly - I would like to just briefly thank the people that came forward and shared their stories with us.
It is only a few people that come here. This is only a very small fraction of the people that were injured in the previous violence. It is very sad to listen to mothers and fathers who have lost their children. Or who’s - who were oppressed in an ungodly manner. This was done in such a way that the dignity of our people was demeaned.
It is terrible to hear that people were treated so badly. It is terrible to think that your mother or your father could be mishandled by just young men. One young man said here yesterday he is the son of the lady who we started with today. This man was talking about his brother who died in the army. This young man says he was taken to the border - from the border to a township in Crossroads.
I did not know what I had gone to do there except that I was told that I’m going to protect elders that were being harassed by youngsters.
When this was told to me, I realize that all this stories that we heard about the violence in 1980, that these were youngsters that were chased by police for no apparent reason - together with soldiers. It is clear then that the apartheid regime is a deceptive one. They are told that - the soldiers and the police of the day are told that they should kill people for deceptive reasons. They also believed those reasons that were given to them. He says that as I reflect and I look at the damage I am absolutely shocked that what do our elders - why did our elders - do such evil and - and deceive us like this. He says that he is sorry even though he did not kill anyone, but to be part of such groups makes him question himself a lot.
He says that he is glad that he lived until he saw the truth. However he does continue to say that even though now the truth is out, what’s the point because so many people died. And as they were taught that a black person is not really a human being - it is just a thing to be killed.
What was the Government trying to achieve with all this evil? This all goes to show that the previous Government had no respect for peoples lives. These are very deep lessons that we have learnt.
[indistinct] blow the myth of all the psychological theories that say that when victims emerge after a number of years they have an - a certain resilience that they emerge very healthy, that they are not scared that everything passes. That is a myth because we have heard in the passed two days people coming up here telling us stories of experiences of suffering they’ve had and reliving that suffering as if it was happening in the moment.
We have seen how people come up on stage and shared their tears and shared their pain all over again, because they are reminded - it’s been there, it’s not that it was forgotten. So it is real - it’s the real pain that they have been walking around with.
Especially for those people who are carrying scars not only physical scars but psychological scars of one kind or another. There are a lot of people I will not be able to give you the number, but to think that such - so many young people died.
When I think of Andile Ndelisa and Vuyo who were here yesterday - who wanted to share of their pain, I thought to myself such young children who have lost their lives. Why is this, why does this happen? Why do thirteen-year-olds and sixteen-year-olds just die - just like that.
Petrus was here to tell us how much he was harassed. He’s a young man, there’s nothing he could do him - for himself - there’s nothing he can do for himself even to this day. [indistinct] to accept the rule and the work of the Commission who continue to say that we should not be doing this work because we are opening up old wounds. Why not? Why shouldn’t you open up old wounds? They are there - wound - if you want to move into the future we should reflect on the past. They claim that we are obsessed with the passed, but they are obsessed with the future. And how do you look into the future without exploring what happened in the pass.
This is a contradiction of all psychological theories or many psychological theories and even religious theories which say that in order for healing to take place you must look into the causes of that pain and deal with that pain. Religion as well, you move forward with people because - people who have offended you - because they’ve asked for forgiveness and you have had a opportunity to forgive them. Because you know what they’ve done.
So I fail to understand how people can be harping on the idea that the Commission is opening up old wounds. And the surprising thing is that these people, who are criticizing us for opening up old wounds, often don’t have - don’t have any wounds that they carrying themselves and the people who have got wounds, are seeking to come in front of the Commission and talk about their pain and it’s been - it’s been a relieve for them. They have experienced the process as a catharsis. They come to the Commission because they know that it gives them a kind of catharsis. It allows them to release the pain.
The women who came here in the morning, Ann-Marie McGregor, cannot release the pain because there is something that she does not know…END OF TAPE 2, SIDE B…[indistinct] she could not see the corpse of her child. She did not open the plastic bag - she heard from her brother-in-law that at least apparently his appendages are in tact. He, himself did not see - he just felt on top of the - over the plastic bag. This woman had to live with this, she cannot complete her mourning, her grieving.
There are a lot of people who have come here whose children died in exile therefore you can never really completely heal because you want to at lease see the corpse. What kind of Government is this that says even at the moment of death you cannot see your child.
This is the very Government that says we cannot regress and refer back to old wounds. That we are not going to do. Some people criticize us saying that we are witch hunt . The people who think that the Truth Commission is a witch hunt should look no further than themselves to discover the witches within themselves - the internal witches - that harbour their - their minds. And exercise those witches so that they can then move forward and see the light. Many people have come forward here.
Yesterday we heard from the NG Kerk that - they confessed that they had lived - they lived in a lie. They did not know it was a lie. Now, they are in the light, they have taken out the witches within them.
What I want to say is that people should in introspect and take out the darkness within them. What I want to say lastly is that people complain. They say that we are a Commission of tears, a climax Commission as some newspapers say, it is inevitable. People will cry if they talk of their pain, but I think their real problem is that a lot of our people do not understand if we talk about these things in an emotionally charged context and of cause our context in this country is highly charged, therefore I think it is logical to expect that we should engage our emotions when we talk about our - our history.
And then it is important therefore that when we engage this history, we engage not only our intellect but our empathy as well. I think all those things are important in order that we move forward. Not only for the sake of the work of the Commission but for the sake of the work that will take place among ourselves as citizens of this country.
Thank you.
VERY DISTURBING NOISE IN BACKGROUND - CANNOT HEAR MS GOBODO AT ALL
A lot of times our lips are sealed, there is nothing we can say. It’s organizations under the Governments Laws that is our problem, our lips were sealed.
[indistinct] in this country. The fact that we have got a new dispensation does not mean that we should be silent about the injustices of this country that will take place, because in the same way that white people where used by apartheid to keep it in power. We have reason to be afraid that if it has happened it is a historical fact it happened - white people were using this country and apartheid stayed in power. So now that black people have a vote what guarantee do we have that black people wouldn’t be used to keep other Governments in power?
So I think that we should be very weary - should be vigilant to the society and speak out against injustices in order that - we should talk, we should talk openly if we see any injustices around us. We should not live in fear. 1980 we’ve to scared to be necklaced, around 1970 it was better because at lease people were not killed. But around 1980 you could not dispute anything because you were to scared you’d be necklaced. What kind of justice is that?
We grew up in the culture of Ubuntho???. What kind of life will South Africa have if people will detach themselves from the injustices of the country? It is scary that people will refuse to be disputed. I think it is important to be vigilant and be aware of our rights in the present Government.
I will thank heartedly a lot of people from Paarl. We they were very
co-operative. There are people here who I mentioned:
Mr Cussons - head of the police division.
The Major’s secretary for assisting us with work.
Mr Anthony Souls from the municipality.
We thank Mr Nick Clause.
You might be surprised how we were able to have our cultural display, he helped us. We thank him very much. - [indistinct] exhibition which is still running, it will be running for a month.
And among the items that are displayed at the exhibition is a display around the story of Wallace McGregor. Ms McGregor has a suitcase in her possession with - which is at the exhibition, a suitcase that she received after her - her son died. She was never able to destroy this clothing. The exhibition is also about displays with the violence that occurred in Paarl.
Marietjie Victor helped us.
David Freedman
Susan Botha
We thank them so much. I don’t see them here right now. But they have been very generous in helping us, with building our exhibition.
We also which to thank:
The Superintendent Marais
Captain Carstens
Again and his team for providing a security.
We thank you Solly for the sound as well.
You are probably somewhere around. Thank you for responding to our needs on a [indistinct]
VERY DISTURBING NOISE IN BACKGROUND - CANNOT HEAR MS GOBODO AT ALL
[indistinct] for taking care of us as well and for being present every day throughout our - our hearings. And we thank the community briefers. I would actually like Wendy to thank the community briefers herself, so I leave that for Wendy - if you don’t mind please.
The Traffic Department - we thank the Traffic Department - and we thank the ambulance units for being available on call for us.
There are people who helped us as a team - people who come from our own offices in the TRC and people who assisted us and got out of their own functions in their offices and came to help us here, that’s:
Manchuru Java
Simpeho Ntitchwa
Those two people were very generous with their time and with their energy and ideas. Thank you very much.
Elizabeth Cloete who is our Logistics Manager in this team, has asked me to give a special thanks to all the additional staff that our Regional Manager, Ruth Levin, sent to assist her. We thank you very much for making this hearings possible.
And finally, on behalf of our team:
Dr Wendy Orr
Viola Lengner
Who is a briefer and who was a very important link with the Stellenbosch University.
The statement takers
Sixhibo Mduvane
Kelvin Osh
I don’t see them, they probably are here somewhere.
And finally Fred Erasmus - who is our support services person. We thank you very much for coming here and for gracing this occasion. Thank you so much and we appreciate that you have been able to bear with us all the things that we have had to carry as a team - as members of the Commission and we would like to invite you to share with us at a distance and hold hands with us as we move forward to realize the vision of reconciliation.
Very lastly the panel who joined us from the various parts of - from the various regions outside of Cape Town, we really appreciate you being here.
Thank you Dumisa Ntsebeza for being here the whole time with us from the beginning of the week.
Thank you Piet for not only sitting at the hearings, but for sharing with us all our concerns and for assisting us in reaching out to the community - the larger community in Paarl.
Glenn, thank you so much for coming and being with us for the last two days.
And thank you so much Denzil for coming and being here. Somehow I feel that you had to be here because you are part of the Human Rights Violations Committee - which is a committee that is responsible for the Truth Commission hearings - but none the less, thank you so much for coming.
Thank you. I will give Wendy a opportunity to speak.
DR ORR
Thank you, Madam Chair. I think people don’t often understand the role of the briefers and what you see the briefers doing up here on stage is really only a very small part of their work. They spend a great deal of time with the witnesses before the hearings, preparing them emotionally and practically for what the hearings are going to be about. And then they spent time with the witnesses afterwards debriefing them and then they will still stay on after these hearings are over, so that we can assess the needs of all the witnesses who came here.
And only one of these briefers is a full time employee and that’s Viola Lengner - she heads up the team of briefers and I want to say particular thanks to her.
But then to the people from your community:
From Paarl
From Mbekweni
From Stellenbosch
Who have given their time freely. They have donated their time, taken time of work - some of them are studying and they’ve made time within their studies to come and help us - so they really are very special people.
And they are:
Patricia Gilphellen - who’s from Paarl.
Fred Imquantana and Johan Swanapoel from Stellenbosch.
Stick Lundo and Mteto Williams from Mbekweni.
Thank you very much to all of you.
I also then want to say that although the hearings are over, the Truth Commission is not abandoning this community. We will be coming back in November to hold a follow up - what we call a challenge workshop - in which we will work through with the community. Issues which were raised, problems which have been unearthed and we will try to devise a way forward together.
So we will be back, this isn’t goodbye, this is just a temporary goodbye .
MS GOBODO
Thank you, Wendy. I see that we have got, what we call in psychology, separation anxiety. The thing is over but none of us are standing up to say it’s over. But we think we are held by some kind of force and I will officially announce the occasion closed. Thank you very much.
Could you stand as the witnesses leave.
