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CHAIRPERSON: The next witness which is Mr Solomon Mahlangu who will talk to us about abduction and witness to deaths. Please get to the stand, we will appreciate that.

SOLOMON MAHLANGU: (Duly sworn in, states).

CHAIRPERSON: You may be seated. Thank you very much. I will ask Dr Russell Ally to assist you and we will then, of course, again keep the opportunity open to put further questions to you after your story, but at the moment I hand over to Dr Ally.

DR ALLY: Welcome to you Mr Mahlangu, Solomon Mahlangu. You are going to speak about an incident that took place in April. To be exact on the 14th of April 1986 when you were abducted and shambokked and beaten and also you say that you were witness to other assaults and also to other killings while you were in captivity. Will you please give us an account of your experiences.

MR MAHLANGU: It was on the fourth of April, I was going to school. It was in 1986. I was attending school at Makepoela Secondary School at Kwaggafontein. While I was at school we were the first quarters examinations. After short break a clerk arrived being sent by the Principal that I am called to the office. When I arrived at the office the Principal told me that there are people who need you. There were two of them and I have got to attend the tribal court

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because at the previous weekend they alleged that I made a, I missed something. Thereafter the clerk, the Principal order the clerk to write me a permission because these people had told the Principal that they are taking me just to the tribal court to question me then they will return me to school. The clerk wrote that permission that I have to come back before one because we are writing then. Those people were John Mahlangu. He owns a bar lounge and his twin brother is Josia together with Mr Mobeni. They were driving the late Minister Piet Makawe's car. Because I had the written permission then I was use to Mr Mahlangu and I knew him well. Then I asked him where are you taking me to. He said there is something that I wanted to ask you. I said to Mr Mahlangu over the weekend I did not do anything which I thought was wrong, that I should be taken to the tribal court.

When we arrived at the tribal court they bought me a litre coke. After I drank that cooldrink after five minutes they left me with Josia. They came back again and when they arrived they took me with a (inaudible) table which was driven by John Mahlangu and it looked like as if he was the Minister, he was the driver to Mr Ntolie. He was together with Mabena who was a bodyguard. They took me to Siyabuswa community hall. They did not take me to the tribal court as they said before at school. They took me to the community hall at Siyabuswa. On the road, then they said to me, today boy you are going to tell us the truth. What you said you did not know anything, that is just a myth, that is a myth story. There was a meeting in the weekend and the meeting which you held at school, what was it all about. I told them that at school I do not hold any meeting. I was the

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Chairperson of the debate and of the time we are debating then the meetings we always held at school, it was members of the Debate Committee. There are no other meetings which I held at school. Because they were stupid and illiterate and having high leadership positions they said to me the meeting which I held at school that was all about that meeting at school because I want to burn their shops. They were saying those things whilst they were driving me to the Siyabuswa Community Hall.

Then from Siyabuswa they went to Piet Ntolie. They left me at the car at Piet Ntolie's house, then I was left with John Mahlangu who was the driver to the Minister, Piet Ntolie. He came with Piet Ntolie from his office. He pointed me. Piet Ntolie asked him is this the person. Mahlangu said yes. Then they said he must be taken to the right place where we will see him later. They took me from Ntolie's office. I was taken to Siyabuswa Community Hall. When I arrived at Siyabuswa I met a person who was working at that community hall in Siyabuswa. I was taken to the mess room to the entrance. It had burglar proofs. Then they locked me in there and there was a toilet there. After they locked the door they left that man. They left me there and departed.

That man said to me, my boy, I pity you, are you from school? Then I said, yes, I am from school. Then he said, I am able to see because you are having a uniform. That old man told me that people who enter there, people who come to that room, do not come back. So what you have to do is to pray because if I may release you, they are going to kill me. Then I kept quite. I asked that man what did I do? The old man said to me if you are in that room forget that

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you will go back home. After a short period after they have left I stayed the whole day there without food, without drink I was in that room.

S S Skosana arrived. He was alone at that time. Then he sat on the chair, he was speaking to me through the burglar proofs. He said to me are you Phinie Solomon Mahlangu? I said yes. He said to me those people told me about you. I warned you that if they arrive, just tell them everything they are going to ask you about because I learnt that there was a meeting, there are shops which were broken and I know that you are the person responsible. I want you to tell the truth. I said to him, I do not know anything. There is no person who has sent me. He said to me, alright, then he left.

After that Mdoda Mnswene arrived. By that time I think he was the Minister of Department of Works. He asked me the same questions which S S asked me. Again after that he left.

From there it was dark, it was now dusk and they lit the lamps in the hall. It was round about half past seven at that time. John from Lamola and Mr Mabena. Mr Mabena was drunk and then Imbokhoto entered and they filled the hall. They had big axes, they had sticks and knives and they shamboks and some of them had guns. Then they said to me immediately make a mistake. You know that we are going to kill you. When Mr Mabena entered he came to that room, then they opened me. He said to me because you do not want to tell the truth we are going to tell the truth. Then he punched me. I was in standard eight that time and I was young. He hit me with his face and I fell on the floor. After I fell on the floor he tramped on my body. He opened

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the youth brigade, then they shouted Imbokhoto. Thereafter they started to assault me with the shamboks. At that time I was not able to identify who was beating me, but I was able to see their faces. In the Imbokhoto Youth Brigade, their fathers were business owners. Those people, all of them were Imbokhoto vigilante group. There was one of the boys who we were together at the same school who went to spy at school what I was doing. I have Mr Salala who we were together at school at that time. He know everything. Even in the time when they picked me up he was there.

After I was assaulted I was bleeding and they assaulted me on the body. I do not know what they were stepping me with. Then from there I lost control of my body. Then I was taken again to the (inaudible) table driven by Josia and Mabena was on the passenger seat. Four people were at the back. They were wearing balaclavas. I was not able to identify them. Outside I would see many cars and there were more than 14 cars who were outside. They said to me, we are going my boy, we are going to the last hole. I was driven, I think it was around half past nine, from Siyabuswa Hall. They took me to the place which they called the Place of Mad People. I do not know what made them to take me to Emagezeni. They took a different route to Marble Hall.

When they arrived at Wetnek I was back at the neck. Even if my eyes were swollen I was able to see the direction. When I was trying to turn and look on the sides, they were hitting me, they were pointing me with their guns so that I should look forward. Mr Mabena said to me do you know where are you going. I said to him I do not know where I am going. They said to me you are going to the last hole. The place called Ukutwakeni, the last hole. They

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drove me to the mountainous area. We would go to a place which shows as if we are going to home and we are moving around the mountains and at the end it was a dense forest. The house is right inside the trees and the cars which they were using were faster and they were able to enter in that area. When we arrived in that place, it is a house. It had a double fence and it was high like the wall of this hall. It looked like an old house and it was burglared with iron bars. So if you are in that house you are not able to escape. Then they made me to go out of the van. I was beaten so that when I entered through the door I found other people who were already there who were members of Imbokhoto. The Youth Brigade and the old men. I found a certain man called Makwane. He stays at Kwaggafontein and another Ndebele guy called Sombere Mahlangu, another old man called Motsenyane, his surname is Motsweni and Mr Mabena and all of them, I found them there.

They made me to go inside. They said to me you are going to tell us all because you must tell us all otherwise we are going to kill you. They made to take off my clothes. Then I was naked. They made me to lie down and I was beaten with a pick handle. They were beating me with shamboks. They made me to stretch and holding my hands and feet. I saw then when I was poured with water and I regained consciousness. They said to me tell us the truth. Because I was feeling the pain on my body and trying that if I may go with them I will take them to my friends who were not there. Even if I would take them to my friends they would not find them. At least at that time I will be getting a rest. They told me that you must go and identify all your friends, but firstly we are going to a place where you are

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going to get a list of your friends so that you should be able to identify them. They took me with that (inaudible) table again. I do not know what time was it. I heard another one who asked another one what time is it? Then somebody said it is past twelve at night. Since I was taken around nine o' clock, it was midnight of that day.

They took me back home. They took me home them. When they arrived at home the four men came out. The one with the balaclava, it looked like he was relative to Piet Ntolie and Louis Jonda and Mr Mabena. They accompanied me to the house having guns in their hands. My father was still alive then. When they entered the house they asked me where are my books. Then they went to the bookshelf where we put our books there because there are many kids at our house who attend school. All our books were put in the same place. My mother asked them about my child because she was not even able to identify me because of the voice. I was covered with blood and even that white shirt was covered with blood, but he was able to identify me with the voice. When she asked, they told my mother, they said do not tell, your son is going to tell us the truth. He is a Tsotsi, he is attempting to burn, he was trying to burn our shops. We are going to show him how to leave. He is going to destroy our property. That is why we are coming to take some letters and some books to show his friends. They got a list of the Debate Team. They took that list and said these are the people we want. Poor students who did not know anything, they were beaten for nothing, they did not know.

Fortunately, they were not found on that day because I gave them wrong numbers, wrong house numbers. After I was beaten and even on the way they were beating me. They took

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me to that isolated house where we were and that time it was around past one. When they took me again at that place, but when I estimated the distance, it was around the area of Vaalbank. When I escaped it was then that I was able to see the real place because I was able to see the buses which were coming on a different directions. I was even able to see the reservoirs. When they took me for the second time to be tortured that is where I was assaulted. It seems it was a pick handle because it stabbed me on the side. Then I fell down again. I was unconscious. I was not able to see what happened thereafter. They made me to take off my clothes again. Some of them, because at that time I was still unconscious. They took a certain group then only stalwarts or the leaders remained. That is Swampera, Mokwane. Even Ketu who was testifying here was present on that day. I saw him on Monday during these hearings.

This four who remained, when I regained consciousness for the second time lying down on the floor. That is when they asked me again. They said to me you must pray now. After you have prayed because you do not want to tell us the truth we will see what to do with you. When I looked I was able to see bloodstains on the walls, I was able to see people's bones. You would see people's bones who have died after a long time. They were packed in that house. You could see that many people were killed there and left there. They called that place Umadwadtine. You see that place is Umadwadtine. You ate there. After they finished to talk to me that way I heard one of them saying this Makwane telling the other ones and I was listening. Then he said to Motsonyane you must ask Mamba. This Mamba was Piet Ntolie. They said they would ask him. He asked another one, are you MOUTSE HEARING TRC/MPUMALANGA

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able to shoot. Then the other one said, no, let us go and tell Mamba first. We told him, therefore he left us at the hall. Therefore we should ask him for a directive of what we should do. Then they left, they locked the doors, they locked about two times or two places because they were stupid and they were illiterate, they left a crate there. I prayed, yes I prayed, because when I said God if you are there and you are alive, I want to see and you must help me. I was praying alone there. Then they left. Then I was praying inside. They left a very small window, they were not able to think that I would make some plan to regain my strength and try to break that small window and then get out.

After they left I heard jackals and baboons crying. I was not able to hear them speaking, but it was at dawn at that time. I could see the morning breeze, I could feel the morning breeze. It was a little bit cold. I grabbed the crate. Then I took it directly to the window, next to that small window. The doors were burglar proofed. Then on top of the door was that small window. I broke that window with my shoe. Then I said it is better for me to get out and let them kill me. God helps those who help themselves. I should not just relax inside there. I said it is better to die outside if they are going to kill me. I held the window bars, then I sticked my head. I was cut on just next to my left ear and this ear is having problems, it cannot hear well. I did not get even enough treatment, I still have the same ear problem. Then from there I was able to stick my shoulder and then I was cut on my whole body because of the window panes. After I went out through that window I fell down. Then the next room, when I looked, then I said many

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people have been killed here because of the bones I saw in that house. The next door does not have burglar proofs. They did not believe that the way I was beaten I would be able to get out. Then I said to myself I should leave before they come back. When I looked outside there were two fences. I did not see the direction where I came from, but I saw a short path. It was at dawn at that time, around past four to five. Since I was locked in that house the previous night then I spent almost the whole night there. Before I escaped, what made me to try to escape is because they said I was supposed to die and then therefore they were looking for somebody who is going to shoot me.

DR ALLY: Mr Mahlangu, if, I do not want to lose some of the things that you were mentioning in your story because you give a lot of details and I think it is necessary that we try and focus on some of the important issues. So, if you do not mind, I just want to come to some questions. The first question is really about, you said that you were Chairperson of the Debating Society at your school and you were in standard eight at the time. You were asked questions by these people who you say were Imbokhoto people. Can you just give us some idea of the kinds of debates which use to take place? What were the issues which were being discussed? As briefly as possible, Sir.

MR MAHLANGU: We use to debate, the topics that I can tell you about in shortly. We were talking about the total disarmourment, matrimony is better than monarchy, celibacy is better than matrimony.

DR ALLY: Did you ever debate political issues? You know issues around the conflict at the time?

MR MAHLANGU: Yes, I was debating at school and quoting

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Solomon Mahlangu, Steve Biko and all other activists of African National Congress. I was a sympathiser of the ANC knowing that we were stili under the apartheid Government. Because I was debating at school I was not aware that maybe sometimes the members of the vigilante group, some of them, there are spies at school, those who can go and inform their fathers and come and attack me at school.

DR ALLY: And what was the attitude of the youth towards Imbokhoto? What did they say about Imbokhoto and what were they actually prepared to do about Imbokhoto?

MR MAHLANGU: When they came at school there was a meeting the previous weekend.

DR ALLY: Yes. Sorry, Mr Mahlangu. I want to ask you what attitude? How did the youth, because you said you debated and you discussed these issues. What was the attitude of the youth? The youth who you associated with towards Imbokhoto? How did they feel about Imbokhoto? What kind of things did they say about Imbokhoto?

MR MAHLANGU: We were caucusing about Imbokhoto saying the way Imbokhoto does their activities, we must do something. We are not able to move freely and the ladies who wore trousers during our trips, they were beaten by Imbokhoto because they said woman should not wear trousers. That was one of the reasons which we use to discuss with some of my friends at school.

DR ALLY: Now, in your statement you say that you witnessed killings, but when you gave your testimony now, you actually said that you saw bones. Now what actually did you witness? Are you saying that you saw people being killed, you yourself, by Imbokhoto or that you saw what you thought or believed to be the bones or human remains in this place that MOUTSE HEARING TRC/MPUMALANGA

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where you were taken to?

MR MAHLANGU: When I entered at that slaughter house the people, those who were inside there, there was a scream which I heard. I heard somebody screaming. Then from there I saw bloodstains. When they made me to enter there was one who was removed to a different room. He was taken to the other room and that place is too big and that person was screaming about twice. I saw the bloodstains there before I entered, then I said there are other people here because at that time I was heavily beaten. I was not able to see many things.

DR ALLY: If you can come back to, I was asking whether you, did you actually see people being killed? That is very important because we want to be absolutely clear about what you mean in your statement. We accept that you saw blood, that you heard screams, but did you actually see someone die in that, being killed or was that what you believed actually happened?

MR MAHLANGU: I saw human remains there then I believed that people were killed there.

DR ALLY: So, you did not actually see any killings yourself. You saw human remains which made you believe that people had been killed, but you did not see anybody being killed. So when the statement says that you witnessed killings, it is inaccurate. What it should actually be saying is that you saw human remains and you believed that people had been killed there. Is that a more accurate account of what happened?

MR MAHLANGU: What I was talking about the killing, it was because of the scream I heard that side and the blood which I saw there. Then I said that person has been killed and

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that he has been thrown somewhere.

DR ALLY: And did you ever report this to anybody? Did you report it to the police maybe?

MR MAHLANGU: After this incident, after I escaped I went to Mabopane. When I arrived in Mabopane then from there I experienced the Winterveld Massacre where the person called Mocobene was killing people. Then I went to Kalafong, then I went to Atteridgeville, then again I went to Pretoria Council of Churches where I got assistance from the SA Sisi staff from Bokedu Makane and others until I recovered that I should be able to make contact. Then I made a statement again at the Human Rights and Legal Aid Resource Centre of what has happened to me. To go back to Kwagga, I was afraid that at that time the Imbokhoto was not harassing at that time, for me to stay well. It is then that I, it is after they have killed Skosana, Mantletu where I was able to come and reside peacefully because the place where they took me to at that time. The uprisings have not started yet then in Kwagga and Mantletu because I had a chanced of coming back. Even now I still am not safe, I am not protected. I am still afraid of those people.

DR ALLY: Mr Mahlangu, thank you for your statement, I mean, you have been with us for close to an hour now, but you have given us quite a lot of information and quite a number of leads which we certainly will follow up and try and investigate as many of the claims that you make as possible. Thank you very much.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mahlangu, there may be further questions. Tom, any questions. Mrs Seroke. Mr Mahlangu, may I pursue something. We have listened to the great detail, we have read your statement, we have also read the statement that

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you made under oath to Mr Gill Fillen. So, we have a very comprehensive picture. What remains to me a little bit of a mystery and it is a gap in the information is in your statement that you filled out to the Truth Commission you mention that you were an Executive member, President it says here at one place at the time of the Kwagga branch of UDF. That is 1986/1987. Is that correct?

MR MAHLANGU: May you please repeat the question, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: Let me phrase it the other way round. You say in your statement, what is written here, given to our statement taker, is that you were involved in the UDF. It says where, the question is the place, you say in Kwagga. Then it asks about the positions held and you say here President, Executive Member and it asks about the dates and it says from 1986 to 1987. You did testify that you were in leadership. Can you tell me exactly what that leadership position was?

MR MAHLANGU: It is true that after I came back to Kwaggafontein then we lost the United Democratic, the UDF in Kwaggafontein. Then we went to Khoute House to get members to be protected. At that time we had members of our organisations and were not ...(tape ends)

MR MALAN: Just to respond to the question I want to know what your involvement was, whether you were in leadership of a youth organisation or the UDF itself in 1986 when this incident that you talked to us at length, when that took place. Sorry to interrupt you but I want to get to my need at the moment.

MR MAHLANGU: Yes I was the Chairman of the UDF, Kwaggafontein branch.

MR MALAN: Was this at the time when you were abducted by MOUTSE HEARING TRC/MPUMALANGA

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the alleged Mbokoto members? Was it at the same time?

MR MAHLANGU: It was before I was subjected by Mbokoto to that slaughter house because we were working underground at that time.

MR MALAN: You say - another question is asked in the statement. It asks of you what was your organisation's programme of action at the time. Do you remember such a question? Your answer, can I read it for you. You say:

Was that the action programme of your organisation?

MR MAHLANGU: Yes, that is true.

MR MALAN: Now can you tell me then if you say to fight or cripple how would you fight them and how did you try to

cripple them, your organisation? You don't have to answer these questions if you feel it may incriminate you. I just want to tell you that you don't have to answer it if it incriminates you. But if you could shed some more light upon this question because it seems to me from the statement that maybe the Mbokoto guys took you out because they were responding to something. I am not sure. Can you tell us, are you prepared to tell me something about this?

MR MAHLANGU: We were trying to protect ourselves by forming this organisation. The reason for them to abduct me it was because I was spied. One of the students who were with at that time was able to spy me and was able to monitor my particular activity because at that time we have started with the formation of UDF but we didn't know who was monitoring our political activity at that time.

MR MALAN: Mr Mahlangu I am sorry to come back to this.

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Can you explain to me what do you mean when you say my organisation, the UDF at the time, its programme of action was to fight or cripple Mbokoto. What do you mean by that? To fight or cripple them. Can you give us examples or are you not prepared to respond? You don't have to but if you are prepared can you shed some light on this to me.

MR MAHLANGU: Not exactly to cripple or fight. Our aim was to try to protect ourselves which are the things which we are able to do ourselves during that time. The only thing which they would do was to force us to be members of Mbokoto.

MR MALAN: Mr Mahlangu let me just give you a little bit of an understanding of why I am forcing these questions. In terms of the Act we are obliged to find out what were the circumstances at the time, what were the different

perspectives and motives, what did which group do, what

really was the bigger picture. Now you give evidence about the Mbokoto people taking you away on your own, torturing you, giving you a tough time, beating you up. You were a leader, you were chairman of the UDF branch there at Kwagga. We had a number of other witnesses today who talked about the youth, and they implicated the youth, on abductions, killings, necklacing. You say in your own statement our programme of action was to fight or cripple but when I ask you you simply say to protect ourselves. I mean what did you do to protect yourself? Do you have any knowledge, can you help us? Maybe even confidentially, not here, to give us a bigger picture of specific action.

MR MAHLANGU: I prefer to tell you in camera.

MR MALAN: That is very kind, I really appreciate that because we need the information and that is why I told you MOUTSE HEARING TRC/MPUMALANGA

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that you don't have to answer in public. But if you would be kind enough to, when we see each in an in camera situation please share with us so we can get the bigger picture because we need to report to the nation so that everybody can understand. May I then at this stage thank you very much for coming to the stand. Also for your openness and your frankness. We will certainly, if time allows, and it being occasioned for us, we will meet again. At the moment we will study, as Dr Ally has said, what you have given us and we will follow through on that side and I personally look forward to spending some more time with you to just brief me more about getting to an understanding of the bigger picture of the conflict. I really appreciate that and thank you very much. You may step down.

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